We spend a lot of time discussing what to buy but almost no time discussing how to behave. This post covers watch collecting etiquette, which tends to be learned over time, but often overlooked by many. Part One of Two.
You know, this story reminds me of a watch industry dinner I was at, few years ago now, seated thingy, half the gents in tuxes and the other half wishing they'd worn tuxes, and a gent (and I used the word advisedly) sat down next to me, smirked, and said, as his first conversational gambit, "Do you know who I am?" and it was all I could do to not say, "No, but after that I have a pretty good sense of _what_ you are." I didn't because there was no reason but I thought about it. Oh, I thought about it 😃
Bro, I asked you but wasn’t told to remove my sole ring, anyways, for next time I’ll remember…
My favorite point on this one is - don’t monopolize key people, by far, the most annoying thing that can happen especially when you’re meeting watchmakers, brand owners etc. in a gtg, and the worst offenders are often the ones who oftentimes get a lot of 1-1 time with those people anyways… I hate absolutely nothing more than that, I’ll often shamelessly butt in and then excuse myself after I’ve said what I wanted to say.
Another thing I’ve found annoying is there’s finger food served that typically involves, well, fingers… surprising a huge number of people just handle others’ watches and food without a rinse or sanitize in between… I hate nothing more than oil smudges on leather bands and crystal!
Bingo on the food! I always arrive at our Redbar meetups early to get my food eaten and gone so I. An clean up before the watches start passing around. It seems so obvious but we have to remember that beginning collectors who might have Seikos and Fossils and such may not give it a single thought. Probably bears mention at the next meeting g to ensure folks can be on the same page.
I would add, don't wind it or press the pushers without permission. I also separately ask whether it is ok to take a picture, and whether it is ok to post it. You have a good point about being positive about other people's watches, even if you spot a flaw or it's not to your taste. Tact and courtesy are more rare than Rolexes at retail these days.
But I have never once removed my wedding ring before looking at a watch, and I've never observed anyone doing this behavior before. AITA?
Also, what is up with that chipped case?? I've never seen something like that before.
Agreed - don’t operate without asking. AITA? YES. YATA. 😂
That watch has since been repaired and sold by the guy who owned it when photographed… that’s not a chip, its a v-shaped dent in the bezel, Horrible to see in person. He was, of course, seething.
When putting a watch back into the sexpile or when handing it back to the owner, make sure to follow the owner's lead, i.e. to lay it down as you saw the owner do it (e.g. bracelet open, crown down for Rolex sports watches).
I'd just taken delivery of my BLNR and had worn it to work. I went for a coffee with a colleague who has an appreciation for watches and who had just purchased a Diver 300m. I figured that, as he was the owner of a brand-new watch himself, he'd know how to be fastidious about handling the piece.
I handed him my watch, let him put it on, enjoy it, etc, then watched him put the watch on the table, dial up, and push the watch across the table toward me. As I heard the scraping sound, my heart sank.
There it was. The first scuff on the polished bracelet clasp.
I have another story of a jackass friend who didn't ask how to operate the Reverso Chrono and started pushing the reset actuator before first stopping the chronograph. 🤦🏾♂️
Friends are the worst because they take you, your patience, and your forgiveness for granted.
Eeech! That sounds painful. I think for a lot of people (even people that buy nice watches) they're just tools. To us they're these very precious things we like to keep pristine, but to others it's "just a watch"
I personally don’t care about people taking pictures of my watch without asking. Just don’t tag me or post right away. I generally do ask people if I can have a look at their piece. Handle all pieces with care when it comes to watches is the general rule I guess.
The origin of this one is a friend who has had several unique or limited watches commissioned by brands who have specifically asked for these not to be shared on social media. This is to avoid being inundated with requests, or to avoid other VVIPs feeling aggrieved by not being invited to buy one. Now, putting aside how one feels about this "first world problem" - the counter is that they could have just chosen to NOT show you at all... to which one might say, "yeah well, if they didn't specify I can't take photos, then it's on them" ... and what I am driving at is it is better to err on the side of "permission" in the "forgiveness/permission" equation. The alternative is a lose-lose, which is easily avoided!
Totally agree with this. Like some people value privacy. And while you might say you give that up in public spaces… why do that to someone? At least ask.
I recently learned this the hard way, during a small gathering when we were discussing watches and sharing stories. I photographed a person’s watch while their son was photographing mine. The son didn’t ask, and I didn’t ask, but I instantly felt thoughtless when I saw the father’s reaction. I apologized and offered to delete the photo, but he said it was ok. Ironically, I took the photo because the father was asking me for specific information about his watch (a vintage Rolex) based on its features, that he did not know. Anyway, lesson learned.
I get the intent behind this, and I see several additional points I have already been discussed in the comments, so I won't go over everything again. What does stand out to me is that much of this etiquette reflects a very particular collecting philosophy, one centred on keeping watches pristine and protecting future value...
That is ofc a valid approach and personal preference for many, but it is not universal. Collectors who are fine with natural wear operate under a different assumption and the "investment value" of watches today seems a key driver for the increased desire to keep watches pristine (and even increased presence of safe queens) to the extent microscratches are an annoyance to some rather than a realistic and natural result of normal and perfectly careful wear.
If a watch being handled with the same care its owner applies day to day is unacceptable, then the issue to me is not manners but expectations around preservation. The fact that many of these rules would also likely matter far less at a lower price point suggests value protection plays a bigger role here than is openly stated perhaps?
I also don’t agree with the blanket ring rule for the record, for several reasons:
1. It is perfectly possible to handle a watch without a ring coming anywhere near the case, for example by holding the strap/bracelet only, which I tend to do anyway to avoid fingerprints and make sure my hands are clean before. Or when holding or operating the watch to use the other hand with ring (we have two remember!).
2. Removing a wedding ring introduces its own risks (dropping/forgetting/losing) and often carries far more personal value than any watch being handled.
3. I doubt owners remove their own rings when handling their own watches, so seems hypocritical unless they also take off their ring and wear gloves handling other or their own watches. Then it makes sense to match them as courtesy.
4. Wedding bands are often rounded, soft metals and not something that typically easily damages most watches and the inverse might actually be more common, should I also get outraged if your steel watch puts another dent in my platinum wedding band? Of course there are exceptions with chunky or sharp edges rings and of course diamonds or other hard stones should obviously be kept well clear from watches.
5. The act of taking off the ring might involve having to put the watch down, which is more likely to cause damage depending on the surface or increase risk of dropping etc compared to being handled in soft hands.
More broadly, I think etiquette should be functional rather than ritualistic. Matching the owner's own level of care makes sense, but symbolic gestures do not always prevent real damage, watches still get dropped too or handled poorly in placement on a surface and that is more likely if you make someone nervous handling the watch in the first place!
What matters more to me is consent and judging (as well as being aware of your own) general competence, don't give a kid or clear clumsy person your watch in the first place. Activating complications, winding, or setting a watch without knowing exactly how it works and most importantly stacking watches (didn't see that but is my biggest pet peeve, sharp crowns will destroy another case easily!) is far more likely to cause harm than a ring that never touches the case. Also expressing clear expectations if you have them beat unspoken rules every time. Maybe just carry a set of nice gloves, like the boutique does, if you wish to protect your timepiece so much. But consider who will look like a douche in that scenario if you hand someone gloves alongside your watch. 😉
I guess the counterpoint to all this would be to say don’t bring your precious irreplaceable pristine NOS scratchless watch to a meet up where it will get the demolition derby rock ‘em sock ‘em robot treatment. When I started going to redbar in 2017 everyone just threw their watches in a pile in the center of the table and you were free to paw at them and fondle the pushers and crowns to your heart’s desire but it’s not like that anymore
You and me both... Besides, I pray my ego never reaches a point where I’m plastering my own opinions around as directives for others to follow. In a safe-ish space like this it is already… borderline 😅
Excellent post and should be required reading before collectors attend their first meetup. I think the rules about asking before photographing and touching are dependent on the rules of the particular meetup. At our meetup, if a watch is placed on a table, it's generally accepted that said watch can be photographed and/or touched without asking.
However, the 2nd most important rule of meetups behind removing rings/bracelets, and one that should never be broken, is to never manipulate a watch (turn the bezel, screw/unscrew the crown, press pushers, etc.) without asking the owner. Even if the owner places a watch on the table, that does not give you free reign to manhandle it with reckless abandon. You'd be surprised how many collectors will just grab a random watch off the table and start repeatedly screwing/unscrewing the crown and/or pressing chronograph pushers like the watch is some sort of fidget spinner. Watches in general, and vintage watches in particular, might have sensitive components that the owner doesn't want you to press/turn 150 times in that span of a couple of minutes. I always wince when I see someone grab a vintage chronograph and go to town on the pushers without even approaching the owner first.
If you are really interested in getting a feel for a particular bezel action or pusher actuation, find the owner and politely ask them if you can try it once... not 150 times.
Good points… I noticed a couple of other comments on this theme - so true. Reminds me of a time at one Redbar where someone had their Sky dweller jammed up because people were fooling around with the ring-command bezel and apparently didn’t know what they were doing. That was pure disrespect, I suppose.
I’m proud if someone wants a pic of my watch! … but am mostly in Canada and Japan - places where security is a low to non existent concern. BUT Visiting an AD in LA, and seeing a Remy Cools subscription Tb on a customer we were chatting with, I was excited to take a pic - he immediately stopped me! Saying I could only take if for me personally, and no socials. I re assured all good - so pic was ok. theft and danger is a real concern in the US, so I totally understand if a whale like he was doesn’t want his 200k watch to be public knowledge!
a question asked for someone else (I promise) - lets say Ive (or someone else) put on a bit of weight since getting married and that wedding just aint coming off - whats the ettiquite? just never touch anothers watch?
Wow, this terrific article sure hit a nerve--35 comments so far and counting. I can't argue with any of it, either, but the contrarian devil on my right shoulder is intrigued by the contrast between the apparent expectation that a (new?) watch should remain forever unscratched, as expressed here, and the reverence for scuffs and scratches and who knows what else on vintage watches. Said blemishes are often referred to as providing the watch with "character," and woe to the collector who polishes them away. Intriguing distinction, hmmmm?
I’m guilty of not always removing my wedding band. I need to be more mindful of that in the future. That said, I’m generally very careful when handling somebody’s watch. To the extent I worry about creasing the strap if I’m putting it on my wrist.
I might also add: ask before using the functions or winding the watch. I can’t remember somebody ever being opposed to it. But maybe it needs a service, maybe the movement is just incredibly delicate (vintage, high complication, etc.).
And, yeah, you don’t need to express a negative opinion even if it’s something you’d never consider. Can still be fun to see. Like I’d love to inspect a high complication Hublot in person, even if there’s 0% chance I’d ever wear one (not even a matter of personal preference there: the lugs would extend multiple mm beyond my wrist).
You know, this story reminds me of a watch industry dinner I was at, few years ago now, seated thingy, half the gents in tuxes and the other half wishing they'd worn tuxes, and a gent (and I used the word advisedly) sat down next to me, smirked, and said, as his first conversational gambit, "Do you know who I am?" and it was all I could do to not say, "No, but after that I have a pretty good sense of _what_ you are." I didn't because there was no reason but I thought about it. Oh, I thought about it 😃
A fantastic story in a single paragraph. The second “[oh,] I thought about it” is where I laughed out loud. 😂
Bro, I asked you but wasn’t told to remove my sole ring, anyways, for next time I’ll remember…
My favorite point on this one is - don’t monopolize key people, by far, the most annoying thing that can happen especially when you’re meeting watchmakers, brand owners etc. in a gtg, and the worst offenders are often the ones who oftentimes get a lot of 1-1 time with those people anyways… I hate absolutely nothing more than that, I’ll often shamelessly butt in and then excuse myself after I’ve said what I wanted to say.
Another thing I’ve found annoying is there’s finger food served that typically involves, well, fingers… surprising a huge number of people just handle others’ watches and food without a rinse or sanitize in between… I hate nothing more than oil smudges on leather bands and crystal!
😂 nah you’re good.
Oh what a huge oversight on my part… EXCELLENT addition ref the clean hands. Gosh. 😅
Bingo on the food! I always arrive at our Redbar meetups early to get my food eaten and gone so I. An clean up before the watches start passing around. It seems so obvious but we have to remember that beginning collectors who might have Seikos and Fossils and such may not give it a single thought. Probably bears mention at the next meeting g to ensure folks can be on the same page.
Great article.
And oil smudges on alcantara bands are the worst 😭
I hate oily smudges I agree 💯
I would add, don't wind it or press the pushers without permission. I also separately ask whether it is ok to take a picture, and whether it is ok to post it. You have a good point about being positive about other people's watches, even if you spot a flaw or it's not to your taste. Tact and courtesy are more rare than Rolexes at retail these days.
But I have never once removed my wedding ring before looking at a watch, and I've never observed anyone doing this behavior before. AITA?
Also, what is up with that chipped case?? I've never seen something like that before.
Agreed - don’t operate without asking. AITA? YES. YATA. 😂
That watch has since been repaired and sold by the guy who owned it when photographed… that’s not a chip, its a v-shaped dent in the bezel, Horrible to see in person. He was, of course, seething.
I bet that’s the last time he lends an FP Journe to a blacksmith
My wife has a rule for my kids. “Don’t bring to the playground what you don’t want other kids to play with or which you would be sad if it broke”
I'd add the following:
When putting a watch back into the sexpile or when handing it back to the owner, make sure to follow the owner's lead, i.e. to lay it down as you saw the owner do it (e.g. bracelet open, crown down for Rolex sports watches).
I'd just taken delivery of my BLNR and had worn it to work. I went for a coffee with a colleague who has an appreciation for watches and who had just purchased a Diver 300m. I figured that, as he was the owner of a brand-new watch himself, he'd know how to be fastidious about handling the piece.
I handed him my watch, let him put it on, enjoy it, etc, then watched him put the watch on the table, dial up, and push the watch across the table toward me. As I heard the scraping sound, my heart sank.
There it was. The first scuff on the polished bracelet clasp.
I have another story of a jackass friend who didn't ask how to operate the Reverso Chrono and started pushing the reset actuator before first stopping the chronograph. 🤦🏾♂️
Friends are the worst because they take you, your patience, and your forgiveness for granted.
Jeeeez. Hopefully that wasn’t a concrete park table 😂
Eeech! That sounds painful. I think for a lot of people (even people that buy nice watches) they're just tools. To us they're these very precious things we like to keep pristine, but to others it's "just a watch"
I personally don’t care about people taking pictures of my watch without asking. Just don’t tag me or post right away. I generally do ask people if I can have a look at their piece. Handle all pieces with care when it comes to watches is the general rule I guess.
The origin of this one is a friend who has had several unique or limited watches commissioned by brands who have specifically asked for these not to be shared on social media. This is to avoid being inundated with requests, or to avoid other VVIPs feeling aggrieved by not being invited to buy one. Now, putting aside how one feels about this "first world problem" - the counter is that they could have just chosen to NOT show you at all... to which one might say, "yeah well, if they didn't specify I can't take photos, then it's on them" ... and what I am driving at is it is better to err on the side of "permission" in the "forgiveness/permission" equation. The alternative is a lose-lose, which is easily avoided!
Totally agree with this. Like some people value privacy. And while you might say you give that up in public spaces… why do that to someone? At least ask.
I recently learned this the hard way, during a small gathering when we were discussing watches and sharing stories. I photographed a person’s watch while their son was photographing mine. The son didn’t ask, and I didn’t ask, but I instantly felt thoughtless when I saw the father’s reaction. I apologized and offered to delete the photo, but he said it was ok. Ironically, I took the photo because the father was asking me for specific information about his watch (a vintage Rolex) based on its features, that he did not know. Anyway, lesson learned.
That’s a cool story which left me wondering the age of the aforementioned father and son 😂
The father is 70, the son is 29.
ah, typical curmudgeon then 😂
Watch your mouth
You trying to become typical or what?
I get the intent behind this, and I see several additional points I have already been discussed in the comments, so I won't go over everything again. What does stand out to me is that much of this etiquette reflects a very particular collecting philosophy, one centred on keeping watches pristine and protecting future value...
That is ofc a valid approach and personal preference for many, but it is not universal. Collectors who are fine with natural wear operate under a different assumption and the "investment value" of watches today seems a key driver for the increased desire to keep watches pristine (and even increased presence of safe queens) to the extent microscratches are an annoyance to some rather than a realistic and natural result of normal and perfectly careful wear.
If a watch being handled with the same care its owner applies day to day is unacceptable, then the issue to me is not manners but expectations around preservation. The fact that many of these rules would also likely matter far less at a lower price point suggests value protection plays a bigger role here than is openly stated perhaps?
I also don’t agree with the blanket ring rule for the record, for several reasons:
1. It is perfectly possible to handle a watch without a ring coming anywhere near the case, for example by holding the strap/bracelet only, which I tend to do anyway to avoid fingerprints and make sure my hands are clean before. Or when holding or operating the watch to use the other hand with ring (we have two remember!).
2. Removing a wedding ring introduces its own risks (dropping/forgetting/losing) and often carries far more personal value than any watch being handled.
3. I doubt owners remove their own rings when handling their own watches, so seems hypocritical unless they also take off their ring and wear gloves handling other or their own watches. Then it makes sense to match them as courtesy.
4. Wedding bands are often rounded, soft metals and not something that typically easily damages most watches and the inverse might actually be more common, should I also get outraged if your steel watch puts another dent in my platinum wedding band? Of course there are exceptions with chunky or sharp edges rings and of course diamonds or other hard stones should obviously be kept well clear from watches.
5. The act of taking off the ring might involve having to put the watch down, which is more likely to cause damage depending on the surface or increase risk of dropping etc compared to being handled in soft hands.
More broadly, I think etiquette should be functional rather than ritualistic. Matching the owner's own level of care makes sense, but symbolic gestures do not always prevent real damage, watches still get dropped too or handled poorly in placement on a surface and that is more likely if you make someone nervous handling the watch in the first place!
What matters more to me is consent and judging (as well as being aware of your own) general competence, don't give a kid or clear clumsy person your watch in the first place. Activating complications, winding, or setting a watch without knowing exactly how it works and most importantly stacking watches (didn't see that but is my biggest pet peeve, sharp crowns will destroy another case easily!) is far more likely to cause harm than a ring that never touches the case. Also expressing clear expectations if you have them beat unspoken rules every time. Maybe just carry a set of nice gloves, like the boutique does, if you wish to protect your timepiece so much. But consider who will look like a douche in that scenario if you hand someone gloves alongside your watch. 😉
😂 never change, brother.
I guess the counterpoint to all this would be to say don’t bring your precious irreplaceable pristine NOS scratchless watch to a meet up where it will get the demolition derby rock ‘em sock ‘em robot treatment. When I started going to redbar in 2017 everyone just threw their watches in a pile in the center of the table and you were free to paw at them and fondle the pushers and crowns to your heart’s desire but it’s not like that anymore
100%, can be super tempting to want to show off your new piece but you gotta accept some probability that it won't be pristine by the end of day.
Should make a PDF version of a poster so organizers of collector meets can print it out and post it at the door. lol
Just remember to add a QR code so they subscribe 😂
That’s a suggestion for you. I’m too lazy.
You and me both... Besides, I pray my ego never reaches a point where I’m plastering my own opinions around as directives for others to follow. In a safe-ish space like this it is already… borderline 😅
That's just more admin.
Excellent post and should be required reading before collectors attend their first meetup. I think the rules about asking before photographing and touching are dependent on the rules of the particular meetup. At our meetup, if a watch is placed on a table, it's generally accepted that said watch can be photographed and/or touched without asking.
However, the 2nd most important rule of meetups behind removing rings/bracelets, and one that should never be broken, is to never manipulate a watch (turn the bezel, screw/unscrew the crown, press pushers, etc.) without asking the owner. Even if the owner places a watch on the table, that does not give you free reign to manhandle it with reckless abandon. You'd be surprised how many collectors will just grab a random watch off the table and start repeatedly screwing/unscrewing the crown and/or pressing chronograph pushers like the watch is some sort of fidget spinner. Watches in general, and vintage watches in particular, might have sensitive components that the owner doesn't want you to press/turn 150 times in that span of a couple of minutes. I always wince when I see someone grab a vintage chronograph and go to town on the pushers without even approaching the owner first.
If you are really interested in getting a feel for a particular bezel action or pusher actuation, find the owner and politely ask them if you can try it once... not 150 times.
Good points… I noticed a couple of other comments on this theme - so true. Reminds me of a time at one Redbar where someone had their Sky dweller jammed up because people were fooling around with the ring-command bezel and apparently didn’t know what they were doing. That was pure disrespect, I suppose.
I’m proud if someone wants a pic of my watch! … but am mostly in Canada and Japan - places where security is a low to non existent concern. BUT Visiting an AD in LA, and seeing a Remy Cools subscription Tb on a customer we were chatting with, I was excited to take a pic - he immediately stopped me! Saying I could only take if for me personally, and no socials. I re assured all good - so pic was ok. theft and danger is a real concern in the US, so I totally understand if a whale like he was doesn’t want his 200k watch to be public knowledge!
Should be required reading. Especially the past around how much was paid / value. Nice work!
Thanks for reading!
a question asked for someone else (I promise) - lets say Ive (or someone else) put on a bit of weight since getting married and that wedding just aint coming off - whats the ettiquite? just never touch anothers watch?
Perhaps it’ll be ok … and given the ring is too tight, the skin around it is probably going to provide sufficient protection 😂
Wow, this terrific article sure hit a nerve--35 comments so far and counting. I can't argue with any of it, either, but the contrarian devil on my right shoulder is intrigued by the contrast between the apparent expectation that a (new?) watch should remain forever unscratched, as expressed here, and the reverence for scuffs and scratches and who knows what else on vintage watches. Said blemishes are often referred to as providing the watch with "character," and woe to the collector who polishes them away. Intriguing distinction, hmmmm?
I mean, I don’t think a new watch should remain unscratched; I just think the owner should be the one to put the scratches on it!
I’m guilty of not always removing my wedding band. I need to be more mindful of that in the future. That said, I’m generally very careful when handling somebody’s watch. To the extent I worry about creasing the strap if I’m putting it on my wrist.
I might also add: ask before using the functions or winding the watch. I can’t remember somebody ever being opposed to it. But maybe it needs a service, maybe the movement is just incredibly delicate (vintage, high complication, etc.).
And, yeah, you don’t need to express a negative opinion even if it’s something you’d never consider. Can still be fun to see. Like I’d love to inspect a high complication Hublot in person, even if there’s 0% chance I’d ever wear one (not even a matter of personal preference there: the lugs would extend multiple mm beyond my wrist).
Note to self: wear Swatch to meet Grant 😂
“Bioceramic” has got you covered
This is legend. Extremely well put together. Agree on basically all points and wish more people would act by this etiquette
Spread the word 😁